About this episode: “I’m on a holiday. I’m there for the experience, right? But there are other people living their lives. My experience just intrudes in their lives, basically.” says Rutger, a Dutch man who visited Kyoto as a tourist. Rutger and (host) Kaho Koda visited Kyoto together back in 2018. And they still talk about that one evening in Kyoto where they had the same experience, yet very different interpretations of the event. In this episode we talk about Kyoto and tourism. First, we look at the foreign tourists’ experiences and then we take a look at the Japanese perspective. 

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Transcript

INTRO

Rutger: I’m on a holiday. I’m there for the experience, right? But there are other people living their lives. My experience just intrudes in their lives, basically

Kaho Koda: Every episode, we unpack one controversial opinion about the Japanese mindset, culture, and custom. 

Today’s controversial statement explores Kyoto and tourism.  

From Human Burrito Productions, I’m your host Kaho Koda, and this is ‘Controversial Japan’. 

THE STORY

Rutger: I feel like such a white dude talking about your country.

Kaho Koda: Well I’m asking you to talk about it so. 

Rutger is Dutch and he grew up in the Netherlands. And he happens to be my boyfriend. 

Winter of 2018, we visited Japan together. This was his first time in Japan but he already knew a lot about the Japanese culture because of our relationship. We’ve discussed topics related to Japan, believe me, many many times. So his view on Japan had a tint of me prior to the visit. 

After visiting friends and family in Tokyo, we took a trip to Kyoto. It was actually my first time in Kyoto as well. 

Kyoto needs no introduction. It was the original capital of Japan for centuries until the capital moved to Edo, now named Tokyo. Kyoto is filled with significant temples, shrines, and artifacts. When you think of Kyoto, you might think of 伏見稲荷, famous for the red 千本鳥居, the thousand red toriis that tourists love so much that it’s always trending on Instagram. 

One evening, we looked for a restaurant in the touristy part of Kyoto. We eventually decided to go into a traditional Japanese izakaya restaurant. 

Rutger: The waiter, or the head waiter snapped his neck, very quickly looking at me. And I could just see panic in his eyes.

Kaho Koda: As soon as the waiter saw Rutger, he glanced towards a chef behind the counter. He was an older looking man, maybe in his 50’s or 60’s, wearing a white chef’s uniform. Safe to assume he was the head chef. He looked at Rutger and.. shook his head. 

Rutger is white, evidently a gaijin, a foreigner. I quickly understood what was happening. We were about to be denied service. After the head chef signaled ‘no’ to the waiter, the waiter approached us. Before the waiter could say anything to us, I blurted out, 「二人なんですけど、お席空いてますか？」meaning, “We’re two people, do you have any space left?”. 

The waiter looked surprised that I spoke in Japanese. With my tanned skin and how I dress, I’m often told I don’t look Japanese. He probably suspected that we were both gaijin, foreigners. He hesitated for a second but let us sit. 

Rutger: But yeah, they almost denied us service. The moment I got in, very quickly I got the feeling like I wasn’t supposed to be there. And they were like “No no no, it’s not gonna work.” So you asked for a table and we eventually did get one, but it wasn’t a table. We were stuffed away in a corner, which I found was quite funny.

Kaho Koda: There were empty tables at the back.. But no, we were given the counter seats right by the entrance. Early January, so every time a customer walked in, there was a breeze. The empty tables in the back, maybe they were reserved seating… I hope that was the case. The food was good, but the interaction with the waiter, how the head chef shook his head looking at Rutger, left a bad taste in my mouth. 

After dinner we decided to go to a hidden bar that Rutger found online. 

We sat next to a couple. It turned out they were from Australia. A white woman and a black man. We began by making awkward eye contact with each other and in ten minutes we started talking about where we’re from, why we’re traveling, where we’ve been, you know, the general conversation you have when you meet people who are also traveling… and we eventually got to the topic. I explained what happened earlier at the izakaya. How we were almost rejected at the restaurant.

The Australian couple nodded and then they said, “Yup, we’ve experienced that too. And not just once, but a couple of times”.

Then there was a slight pause. 

And then the husband said, “Is it because I’m black?”

I felt sorry. And I was ashamed. Sorry it happened to them and sorry that they didn’t know the reason why they were rejected. Ashamed and disappointed as a Japanese individual that my country treated this lovely couple in that way. 

In front of the Australian couple, as a Japanese individual, I was the representative of Japan – whether I liked it or not. I felt like I owed them some kind of an explanation.

At that moment, here’s what I said to them. 

“No, I don’t think you were rejected because you’re black. Of course I don’t know the real reason, but I think it’s because you both look like a foreign tourist. They probably didn’t want to go through the trouble of trying to speak in English or translate the menu for you.”

Even though Rutger and I were about to get rejected, we had a way out because, well, I’m Japanese and I speak Japanese. But I was furious. I was offended. They looked at Rutger, saw that he was a foreigner, made an assumption that he couldn’t understand the menu, and decided to say ‘no’ to us… well, which I prevented. What the restaurant was about to do to us, what the restaurant did to the Australian couple, it was discriminatory.

Having lived in Japan, the US, Canada, and now living in the Netherlands, I’ve become very aware of the different types of racism or discrimination. I’ve experienced the typical “go back to your country” scream from a racist elderly person. I’ve gone through ignorant insensitive questions from people I just met. 

In any situation, whether it be an everyday conversation or a one line joke in a tv show, if there’s any racial aspect or discrimination involved, I obsess over it. I replay the scenario over and over in my head and try to justify that the person didn’t mean it in a negative way. I analyze it. I question it. Is the joke funny or is it just plain inappropriate?

So when Rutger, my significant other, experienced something because of the way he looked, I couldn’t let it go. 

However, Rutger didn’t feel the same way. 

Rutger: I didn’t really think anything of it. I just thought it was a funny situation. But you were very much offended, which got me to think about it basically. I didn’t feel offended or I didn’t feel rejected or I didn’t feel there was racism in it. As for you, you pretty much felt differently about that. 

The restaurant doesn’t carry an English menu so that would be the first problem. They are just not set up for foreigners that do not speak Japanese. And I’m going to have a great time but I’m gonna be a difficult client for the waiters and chefs… so yeah I totally understand their point of view or they’re less inclined to serve us. They would probably say like “No no no. No space” or whatever and they would probably win me out on a bit of an excuse. They would send me out.

I didn’t feel anything about it. 

Kaho Koda: Many Japanese people have a difficult time speaking in English. It’s difficult to give you an exact percentage of people who don’t speak English – Some websites say over 60% some say 70…. What’s the best way to measure English fluency anyway? But to give you an idea, I’ll give you a stat from the TOEFL iBT test – It’s a standardized test for English as a second language and the scores are used for employment, university applications, and so on. The test has four components. Reading, writing, speaking, and listening. Amongst Asian countries, Japan ranks last in the speaking category. 

Rutger understands that he’s a tricky client in Japan. And he’s okay with restaurants refusing to seat him.  

And then he recalled another evening where we went to a whiskey bar in Kyoto. The bar was empty when we arrived. 

Rutger: The bar was very empty and very tiny. There was one bartender. Almost like a living room kind of setting. We walked in and immediately again, panic in his eyes. And a little bit of comfort in the fact that you spoke Japanese. But he served us a drink, but then because we were sitting there, other people came in… very clearly Japanese business men. They had their suit on and it was their end of day. Hard work. They came there to have their evening together. Every time someone would walk in, they’d see the regulars at this bar, and they think “hey, there’s a foreigner”. And I got that sense very strongly. Obviously you and I felt very weird there. So after one drink we got out and left, eventually.  

Kaho Koda: He added, it wasn’t that we were not welcome there but we just clearly didn’t belong there. 

It’s true. All these older men in business suits and us wearing sweaters and jeans, looking like tourists. Well, we were tourists. 

Rutger: The one thing that the Japanese people are praised for, is their ability to produce high quality stuff. High quality service, high quality stuff. What they make, they make it well. Whatever they do, they always do it better. I feel, at least.  

Kaho Koda: Rutger’s saying that the Japanese pursue high quality products and services. And that’s also the case at this whiskey bar.

Rutger: Whatever that a bartender is supposed to do, he does it to the best of his ability. And this bar was clearly meant for regulars who come at the end of the day who have their drinks together… and cigarettes. That’s his purpose, that’s the one thing he does. And he does that very well. He probably knows all the drinks and knows what to make. That is what he’s set up for and what he strives for. What he wakes up to every day. 

And then I walk in. This stupid foreigner who wants to have an experience. What do you do with that? How do you… it doesn’t fit into the world, right? I’m on a holiday. I’m there for the experience, right? But there’s other people living their lives. My experience intrudes in their lives, basically. 

I think it’s also beautiful that this one establishment does this one thing and does this very well. And caters to the niche that they’re in and not to anything else. I think there’s also beauty in that. 

Kaho Koda: Today I want to discuss Kyoto and tourism in Japan.

First, let’s look at other foreign tourists’ experiences – the good and the bad. And later, we’ll look at it from the Japanese point of view – their frustration towards tourists. 

FOREIGN TOURISTS’ POINT OF VIEW

Kaho Koda: I want to start off by talking about how Kyoto is so different from other cities. I’ll let the internationals explain the uniqueness of Kyoto.

First off, let’s start in the bigger context – comparing the east and west of Japan. Here’s Rutger. 

Rutger: When we were in Tokyo, the waiters were very polite and very apologetic. Versus Kyoto where people were way more laid back. They were a bit louder. Very different atmosphere I guess. Way more outspoken. They’re louder. 

Kaho Koda: Rutger felt that people in the west were friendlier and easier to approach compared to people in the east. We separate the two as Kansai (that’s the west – Kyoto, Osaka are cities you may know) and Kanto (that’s the east – So Tokyo).

Lizzie also felt the difference between the east and west. She currently lives in the Kansai area, so the west, but she also lived in Tokyo for a short period of time. She’s from London.

Lizzie: Tokyo just feels a little soulless to me, which might be a bit harsh. It’s a really cool place to visit. It’s very like city anonymous commuting type of place. 

Kansai is friendlier in some ways. But in other ways… I don’t know if ‘ruder’ is the right word, but less uptight about the manners – not that that’s not there. But compared to Tokyo, on the one hand it means that they’re more open and friendly, but also, not going to feel embarrassed about staring at you. 

Kaho Koda: Rutger, my boyfriend, also mentioned all of the staring. He said he felt a lot of stares in both Tokyo and Kyoto. He’s a gaijin, and not that foreigners are uncommon in Japan, but Japanese people still stare. And in Tokyo, when he stared back at the person who was staring, they would quickly look away as if to pretend they were not looking in the first place. But when he visited Kyoto, he realized that people in Kyoto just kept staring. And he stared back, like a staring contest. He found it funny and interesting that there was such a contrast.  

Japanese people always mention the difference in personality between Kansai and Kanto. 

The classic example that a Japanese person gives when explaining the difference between the two regions is this. 

Let’s say you’re on a busy street and you trip and fall over. And it’s very clear that you’re gonna be okay. 

In the east, so in a city like Tokyo, people will pretend they don’t see you. They walk around you. They pretend you didn’t fall.. As if you don’t exist. They pretend because they know it’s embarrassing to fall so they quickly look away.

On the contrary, if you were in the west, so like Osaka or Kyoto for example, a couple people would rush towards you and help you up while they crack jokes like, “oh my gosh, are you okay? You need to watch where you’re going!” They joke and they keep it light.

Kansai, the west, is more approachable and friendlier whereas Kanto, the east, is a big city where you’re more anonymous, a little cold. 

And it’s not just the east and west that have personality differences. Even in the same Kansai area, there can be a massive difference between two prefectures. 

Here’s Erik talking about it:

Erik: I had never seen such a massive change in character between people. And in Osaka, during the time I was there, people would joke about that. 

Kaho Koda: Erik is Dutch and he grew up in a small town in the Netherlands. He used to live in Osaka and Tokyo. When he lived in Osaka, people from Osaka would say the following: 

Erik: From Osaka people, I was told that they are the warmest people. And that Kyoto people are the coldest people. 

Kaho Koda: Osaka is located southwest of Kyoto. The two prefectures have a friendly rivalry going on. It’s a thing.

I’ve mentioned this in previous episodes – Japan is a homogenous country. 98% of the population are Japanese citizens. 

If you do not look Japanese or Asian, you stand out. Rutger, Erik, and Lizzie are white. They do not look ‘Japanese’ at all. They are foreigners, 外人, in Japanese. You probably heard me use this word earlier in this episode. 

I asked internationals what their experiences were like traveling through Japan. Of course there’s both good and bad. Let’s start with the good.

Overall, Rana had a positive experience. Rana is an Asian Canadian woman, born and raised in Montreal, Canada, from a Chinese and Canadian household. I will add that her bicultural looks make her ethnically ambiguous. In early 2020, she visited Japan so I asked her if she was ever denied service at a restaurant. 

Rana: No, it didn’t happen to me. I think I was privileged to either have people around me who spoke the language or maybe I just sat down and opened up my google translate. 

Kaho Koda: She spoke about a time she went into a tiny gyoza restaurant in Kobe. Kobe is an hour away from Kyoto by train. And it’s a part of Kansai, the west.

She said that the gyoza restaurant had a counter with 6 seats. 2 women were making the food behind the counter. There were three men who were there and they understood English – they helped her out. She said that it was not so great communication but so welcoming. And she remembers it as a heartwarming story. 

Rana: When I stepped into that restaurant, they were terrified. But you know, as soon as you pull out a book or pull out a translation app, it really does help. And people were open to that. As long as you are receptive and clock into how people are feeling about it. That is my privileged experience. I don’t think everyone has that. 

Kaho Koda: In addition, she mentioned that everywhere she went, everyone spoke to her in Japanese. They didn’t try to speak in English. She liked that.

Rana: I appreciate it! I think that it’s super important because I am coming to your country. Why should it be that you have to interact in a different language? It should be me. I should be the one translating to be able to communicate with you. I am coming to your country. The fact that I am privileged to be here. I should be respectful to your culture. 

Kaho Koda: She believes that as a visitor to the country, she shouldn’t expect Japanese people to speak in English to her. Instead she should try her best to communicate in Japanese. Whether it be through Google translate or gestures, at least she has to try. That’s how she feels. 

And here’s Michele also from Montreal, Canada. She told me about a time when she was visiting Kawasaki – that’s in the Kanto area, east Japan.  

Michele: My first time in Tokyo, I was with a couple of friends and we went to Kawasaki to this cool arcade at 7 in the morning because we were jetlagged. We ended up talking to this local when we were done playing all these games. “Do you have any ramen places to recommend?” “Oh yeah, come into my car, I’ll take you with me…

Kaho Koda: She was slightly worried, but she was with three male friends so she was comfortable enough to get in the car.. She’s also tall and strong. 

Michele: He ended up driving us out to Chiba and the ramen shop he wanted to take us was closed, so he brought us to Chiba. And he showed us all the views. And then put 1000 yen into the vending machine. “Buy whatever you want!” And he took such good care of us. Afterwards when we finally got to the restaurant we treated him. He was just so sweet and so kind. It was unlike anything that I’d ever experienced before. 

Kaho Koda: Japan is a relatively safe country… But this is not something I recommend you to do…. I’m happy Michele had a wonderful experience… But listeners… Please be safe. 

But it’s not just pleasant experiences… Now we need to address the not so great experiences. 

Lizzie told me about what happened at an onsen. 

An onsen is a hot spring. Onsens are everywhere in Japan because there’s so many volcanoes. And usually onsens are huge baths where you bathe with other people – unless you get a private room with an onsen. It’s often gendered: male or female. And you just take a bath with other people staying at the hotel. As someone who went on many onsen trips with my family, I’m used to seeing different kinds of naked bodies. 

Anyway, Lizzie explained what happens to her and her international friends when they visit an onsen. 

Lizzie:  In onsens, we call this the “Gaijin effect” and I can’t really be mad about it. Wherever I go to an onsen and there are more than two of us, as soon as we get into the bath, give it five minutes and all the Japanese people will get out. They’ll all leave. And it’s one of those things where you’re like “I’m not dirty” but on the other hand, you’re like “well now I have the bath to myself” so I don’t know if I can be mad about that. 

The phrase that people use is micro-aggression? I think that’s what it’s called. Again, I’m kind of glad I got to experience them because.. to be brutally honest, I’m a small white girl and I don’t experience a lot of that in England. There are other things that are no way to the level but I hope it’s given me more of an understanding about being treated differently based on your appearance. And I only experience a small amount of that. 

Kaho Koda: Apparently this happens in other places too. Erik told me what happens on the train. 

Erik: I’m not a Japanese person. But it would be nice to be treated with a little bit more respect than people tend to do. Whether knowingly or unknowingly. 

You know the classic example in Japan. You’re sitting on the crowded train but you’re a foreigner and everyone is standing up. Not sitting next to you. And I hate to say it, but it’s happened to me so many times. And I have absolutely no idea what’s going on in the minds of the people that look at me and think “Oh, it’s a foreigner. I will make the conscious decision not to sit next to them although the train is already quite crowded”. 

Kaho Koda: He acknowledged that in the beginning, he thought he wouldn’t be bothered by it, but reflecting on it now, talking about it in this interview, Erik recognized that he was bothered by it. 

Erik: Because it’s the lack of understanding for other people. They don’t consider others’ feelings. Or at least foreigner’s feelings. Because how I experienced this at least is that Japanese people are maybe overconsiderate in many cases. But not for foreigners. Not always for foreigners, I believe.  

Kaho Koda: But Erik also understands that he never experienced the worst. He’s a good kind of foreigner. I’ll let him explain what he means by that. 

Erik: I also have some friends who are people of color. They joke about the fact that I am a ‘good’ foreigner. Being white. Obviously I can’t judge how they have perceived everything. But I think that’s also an important part to just mention that if you are white in Japan and a foreigner, you are treated differently, yes… but it can be worse, even. 

Obviously white people are privileged around the globe. And that shouldn’t be the case. That’s the climate that we live in at the moment and hopefully the world will come to its senses at one point. And stop that. 

It must be so hard for people of color in Japan… Yeah, and I can’t imagine. I just thought that it was worth mentioning. My experience is still the ‘better’ foreign interaction.   

Kaho Koda: Erik brings up an important point. The experiences of people of color who live in Japan. That in itself is a big topic to address, so I’d like to dedicate a future episode. 

As a foreign tourist, there are beautiful and unique moments that you get to experience with the locals. Some locals love to feed you and some want to help you out. But unfortunately, you may experience some microaggression, as a gaijin, a foreigner.  

Next up: the Japanese perspective. Right after the break. 

Hey guys, writer and host, Kaho here. Thanks for listening to episode 5 of Controversial Japan! If you’ve enjoyed the podcast so far, please help us out by purchasing our merch. When you buy a cute totebag or a tshirt, we get to continue producing more episodes for you to enjoy. Go to shop.humanburrito.com  And thanks for your support! 

JAPANESE PERSPECTIVE

Kaho Koda: You’ve heard the internationals speak. Now I want to get into how Japanese people perceive Kyoto. And how Kyoto perceives foreign tourists. 

Ayumi is a Japanese woman who studies illustration in London. She’s from Tokyo and she said that she views Kyoto as similar to England. 

Ayumi: 京都人のイメージ。そうね、なんか。。。

Kaho Koda: According to Ayumi, Kyoto has a unique atmosphere. And it’s quite an exclusive city. People from Kyoto are not too fond of people who are not from Kyoto. A bit of a snob. Just like in London, tradition and custom are very important in Kyoto. She added that it’s also true that there are many people from Kanto, East Japan, who find Kyoto ‘cool’. Like me, I’ve always admired Kyoto。

And that’s the image from a Japanese person from Tokyo. A generalization, of course, but there’s some truth to it. 

I want to focus on the exclusivity of Kyoto – specifically in the hospitality industry. In Gion, restaurants and traditional tea houses have carried on its tradition for more than 350 years. One tradition being「一見さんお断り」. The concept translates to “we don’t accept first time customers”. It’s like an exclusive club that requires you to have a membership. These high end restaurants and tea houses value quality of service over quantity. 

There’s a built trust between the tea houses and their regular customers. It’s considered inappropriate to discuss payment at the location so the customers receive their bills later. And there’s the trust that they’ll always pay because they always do – they’re regulars. In addition, hostesses and maikos live in these tea houses. It’s unsafe to let strangers into their own home. On the flip side, regulars are trusted by the tea houses. 

Rutger: I think it’s also beautiful that this one establishment does this one thing and does this very well. And caters to the niche that they’re in and not to anything else. I think there’s also beauty in that. 

Kaho Koda: That was Rutger again from the main story. He sees the 「一見さんお断り」 “we don’t accept first time customers” as a wonderful thing. However, some Japanese people find this rule of 「一見さんお断り」. “we don’t accept first time customers” to be snobby. But it’s also a tradition that has worked for more than three centuries. 

So when I talked about how Rutger and I were rejected at the restaurant to my parents, they weren’t in shock or anything. They referred to this idea of rejecting first time customers…「一見さんお断り」and told me to get over it. 

Ayumi: なんだろうね、最近やっぱり外国人が。。。

Kaho Koda: Ayumi visited Kyoto roughly three years ago. It was a solo trip and she was looking for a calming environment. She already knew it was going to be busy so she booked non-touristy places. But she said that there were so many foreign tourists. Lots of tour buses with flags. She didn’t enjoy the big crowds. 

Kaho Koda: Ayumi said that Kyoto is supposed to be quiet and calm… There’s 風情. 風情 means the atmosphere you feel. It can be in nature. A beautiful view. The elegance of something. Zen. Kyoto has that atmosphere, or supposed to. But with too many foreign tourists the atmosphere has changed. 

She spoke with an old Japanese man in Kyoto. He didn’t enjoy the gaijins, the foreign tourists.  

Ayumi:現地の京都のおじさんと話す機会があって。。。

Kaho Koda: He said, “Tourists leave trash behind and they’re so loud. It’s annoying. No respect. No manners“.

From the old Japanese man’s perspective, he categorizes all foreign tourists as gaijin, foreign tourists. It doesn’t matter which country or culture they are from. They’re just not Japanese and therefore don’t understand what he thinks is basic manners. 

Let me get into it a little bit. One of the core concepts in Japan, as a collectivist culture, is「他人に迷惑をかけない」meaning, “Don’t bother others”. From a young age, children are expected to be quiet on public transportation. You have to be considerate of others around you. And in school, there are clean-up times every day. Students clean the classrooms, hallways, toilets, and the entire school as part of education. There are no janitors that clean up after the children. 

It’s also important to note that there are very few garbage cans in public spaces in Japan. People are expected to bring home their own trash. And it’s not always the case, but generally speaking, Japanese people clean up after themselves. 

Japanese people value the idea of “Don’t bother others”. So imagine, all these foreign tourists with various cultural backgrounds visit the supposed-to-be calm and zen Kyoto. Different cultural backgrounds mean that norms, manners, and etiquette vary as well. It’s not good or bad, that’s just how it is. And add a lot of tourists to this situation. 

From the old man’s point of view, these people are loud and are inconsiderate of others. In a way, where the foreigners come from doesn’t really matter. They’re just not Japanese. Japan, the homogenous country, has a strong national characteristic and if you don’t fit into it, you’re a gaijin, a foreigner. That’s the distinction – you are either Japanese or you are not… 

We’ll explore this concept in a future episode. 

Going back to tourism in Kyoto. There are other issues to note. 

Many gaijins want to take beautiful photos of maikos in the Gion area. Maikos wear traditional kimono and wear Japanese makeup. It’s the Japanese aesthetic. And so many gaijins just run after maikos to get the perfect shot. Some even walk into private properties. Taking photos without permission is rude and disrespectful. Often the media shows a crowd of gaijins running after and surrounding the maikos. These maikos, they’re 15 to 20 year old ladies. 

And when many tourists take the bus to visit historical landmarks, the locals can’t get on the bus. There’s just too many tourists who take up physical space. 

But let’s also keep in mind that Kyoto wanted tourists. Back in 2017 the Kyoto mayor signed off on permitting construction of high-end hotels in residential areas, which led to an increase in hotel construction. Now the locals are struggling to find vacant office buildings and homes. 

In recent years, the number of tourists that visit Kyoto exceeds 50 million per year. In the past five years, the number of foreign tourists has quadrupled – of course this figure is pre-covid 19.  

Fall of 2019, the Kyoto city Tourism Association announced a new initiative to revisit how tourism can work in Kyoto. They wanted to rebrand ‘tourism’ to reflect high-end hospitality. They hosted a seminar on how to market towards wealthy tourists and many from the hospitality industry attended. 

For his re-election campaign in 2020, the mayor of Kyoto emphasized that “Kyoto was not a city meant for tourism”. He wanted to focus on re-building a sustainable Kyoto where tourists and locals could co-exist. He had plans to expand public transportation for locals. And he was re-elected for his fourth term.

And we know what happened right after. Covid 19 hit. 

Patrick: At that time when I went in August, it was not crowded at all. Neither Japanese nor foreigners. We went to the imperial palace and you can imagine, there’s a big plaza. There’d only be like three people in total in the entire plaza. It was actually possible to take photos of the building without people in it. It was really eerily empty. 

Kaho Koda: That’s Patrick. He’s first generation Thai American and he teaches English in Japan. Back in August 2020 he took a small trip to Kyoto – he lives in the Kansai area so it’s closeby. He said that restaurants were open at the time of his visit, but it still felt post-apocalyptic. 

Like other tourism dependent cities, Kyoto is struggling through the global pandemic. Kyoto has shifted its focus to catering to Japanese tourists for domestic travel. But the reality is harsh.

The city has gone through multiple periods of state of emergency alerts since the pandemic started and many businesses have closed their doors. Compared to 2019, there was a 60% decrease in the number of people who stayed at hotels in Kyoto.

TAKE AWAY

Kaho Koda: Some foreign tourists are not delighted with the treatment they get from the Japanese during their stay. And some Japanese are frustrated with the inconsiderate crowds of foreign tourists.  

Rutger: I’m on a holiday. I’m there for the experience, right? But there are other people living their lives. My experience just intrudes in their lives, basically.

Kaho Koda: And then there are some who are not bothered, like Rutger. Everyone has their own unique experience and therefore interpretation. 

But as a Japanese individual, I go back to that night at the bar in Kyoto with the Australian couple. To the question, “Am I rejected because I’m black?” 

As someone who knows what it feels like to be rejected in other countries, I can’t help but think: Japan can do better. 

Have you ever traveled to Kyoto? Next time you visit Japan, would you interpret the situation differently? Would you act differently? 

CREDITS

Kaho Koda: Controversial Japan is produced by Human Burrito Productions. 

We interviewed Rutger Wink, Lizzie, Rana Liu, Michele Day, Ayumi Yanagi, Patrick Phan, and anonymous individuals for this episode.

Our sound designer is Junan and you can listen to more of her tunes on spotify. Our theme song, ‘Coast to Coast’ is by Mikara and you can also check out her music via Spotify. Artwork by Macie Matthews, you can see more of Macie’s design on her website maciematthews.com

If you’d like to support our podcast by purchasing our merch – designed by the talented Macie Matthews who also created our podcast cover, visit our webstore: shop.humanburrito.com. 

Check out our website for more info at humanburrito.com and if you’d like to send us a message, you can email us at humanburritoproductions@gmail.com. 

We’ll be back with more controversial opinions about Japan. Till next time.